10 Questions with ... Tom Martens

BRIEF CAREER SYNOPSIS:

As the newly-promoted VP/Radio & Streaming at Warner Music Nashville (WMN), Tom Martens is responsible for overseeing radio and streaming promotion strategies for all three WMN imprints, including WMN, WEA, and WAR. Before earning this well-deserved title, Martens served as Dir./National Radio & Streaming for Team WAR, with additional time spent in Pop promotion at Interscope and experience in programming a Top 40 station. Martens chatted with All Access Nashville to discuss his shiny new title, Warner's focus on both radio and streaming, what music he's looking forward to, and much more in this week's "10 Questions."

1. Tom, thanks for taking time for "10 Questions." You just assumed a ton more responsibility at WMN, with oversight of all three label's radio/streaming promotion teams for WMN, WEA, and WAR. This basically triples your workload, right? So, tell us how you're balancing your day-to-day chores.

To a certain degree it is triple the responsibility, but one thing I was proud of even before I became VP was the phenomenal synergy between all three teams here. We work very closely together on every aspect of all of our artists. There have been times when all three teams have worked collectively to help each other. In that respect, it's easier than you would anticipate it would be, but it certainly has been a lot of responsibility. It's a lot of relying on [WEA Dir./National Radio & Streaming] Adrian [Michaels] and [WMN Dir./National Radio & Streaming] Katie [Bright], who have really made the job easier.

2. I want to back up for a minute and talk about your initial start into the record promotion industry. How did you get your start in this biz?

I was a radio geek, and I still am. I still believe this to be true: I am a radio guy masquerading as a promotion guy. And I'd like to think that's one of the reasons I've lasted as long as I have - because there aren't too many scenarios in a programmer's day that I didn't have to experience at one time myself. I had no aspiration to become a record guy - I really didn't. I was programming a Top 40 station in Texas when my Interscope rep came to take me to lunch, and she said, "Aren't you from Minnesota originally?" and, I said, "Yeah," and she told me they were expanding their team and that I'd be awesome at record promotion. I said, "F that. I am a radio guy. I will never do record promotion." So there's your first lesson of the day: never say never!

3. Before your time in promotion with WMN and in Nashville, you spent a lot of time in Pop promotion at Interscope and Republic. Can you share the difference between these two formats in terms of relationships, partnerships, and cooperation? And, was there a learning curve for you coming in to Country?

There's a huge difference. At the very core of what we do, it's the same. In other words, it's a relationship-based sales position, but that is where the similarities end. The chart structure is way different between Pop and Country; Country is a point-based system, while Pop is not. So, a spin in Wichita, KS equals that of a spin in Los Angeles. Country - although it's starting to change - will give a superstar the benefit of the doubt and stay committed to playing a single for a much longer period. It is still very much an artist-driven format. In Pop, you can get the add, but at some point, the metrics have to be there for them to continue playing it. There's very little of the, "Hey, man, I need you to be a great partner and stick with us on this song." That just doesn't happen on the Pop side; if it doesn't work, it's gone. It's obviously a quicker chart over there, too. I think the average life of single for a Pop record is about 18 weeks, and it's about 35 or 40 at Country. Yes!

4. It's been a couple of years now since WMN shifted its focus for promo teams, including streaming in to that equation. Now that you're overseeing three teams, how differently - if at all - are you coaching reps, and has radio taken any offense?

There were some calls in the beginning saying, "So, you don't care about radio anymore?" and that was obviously not the case. The promotion department at Warner was the largest within the company, and the streaming department had just one guy with all of this revenue coming in. So, it became clear that streaming was something that needed to be incorporated into our world. What we have done and continue to do is educate radio as much as we can about streaming. Putting my Program Director hat back on - there are a lot of great tools, but I don't think there's been a better road map for radio than streaming data right now. The more they understand what it means, the easier their jobs will ultimately become. There is a lot of data - an overwhelming amount of data - so we have to sift through it and find what's relevant.

5. Do you feel as though radio is a little behind, or resistant, when it comes to accepting this data? Because, in your world, you're looking at streaming, Shazam, and sales data on a daily basis.

I wouldn't say they're "behind"; I would say that I think they are trying to understand it and learning more every day about how powerful a tool it can be. I certainly understand why, initially, and somewhat to this day, that they looked at it as competition; it's kind of like when the record companies didn't immediately embrace the Internet upon its arrival; however, I think radio is starting to understand that streaming and these other new players are not going to go away. They're already a part of everyday life. Radio is wisely beginning to accept the technologies and figure out how they can help make their programming decisions that much stronger.

6. What different strategies - if any - are you employing with certain artists when it comes to radio and the streaming platforms? As an example, I saw Tegan Marie at your last "Pickin' On The Patio" here in Nashville. She's only 14 and maybe too young (in the eyes of radio) for the usual full rollout. But, is she perhaps at the perfect point for you to concentrate on the digital side - building a story and a career - so that in a few years, she comes to radio with all that goes with that effort? Another example that comes to mind with this is the Last Bandoleros.

I honestly couldn't say it any better than you just did - that is 100% the plan. We want to develop their presence at streaming and equally as much on social media. We want them to build a fan base, because at some point in time that data can make our job easier when we do take it to radio. The model has always been, "Let's get this music out to radio and run it up the chart, which will result in sales and streams," but what we're learning here is to make sure we are looking at the bigger picture. Let's get radio the right music at the right time and develop the careers of our artists. There's so much music out there that we can't possibly depend on radio to break all of it, so we have to use the other platforms in order to develop our newer artists' profiles.

7. To that point, are the streaming platforms a place where you can vette out an artist or song? We've seen artists and labels increase the release cadence to DSPs, watching one or more emerge as an active song, whereas labels focus on one cut at a time to radio.

As much as [streaming] is a road map for radio, it's a road map for us as well. If a record is not working, if the sales aren't there, if the streaming is not there, we don't spend a lot of time hammering radio to continue to play it. We want the music to work just as much as they want it to work. If we're seeing good sales and stream equivalents, then we're much more apt to continue working a record at radio because there's so much more potential.

8. I've seen WMN back off a few singles this year quicker than is the usual case. For example: Ashley McBryde's second single, "Radioland," as well as Devin Dawson's "Asking For A Friend." These are newer artists, but you guys even did this last year with "Stay Downtown" from Cole Swindell, who has multiple #1 hits under his belt. Many in Country radio wish labels would "fail faster," as Pop labels seem to do. Are these examples situational, or have you seen specific metrics that said grinding away would be counter-productive in the long run?

Every artist and every single is somewhat different, because it has its own story. Another thing I'm proud of with working with Warner is that we'll commit to an artist for the long run. We're very committed to Devin and Ashley. How many albums did Eric Church release, for example, before he had a #1 record? [Three.] We know we have the right artists and that the talent is there, it's just a matter of finding the right songs to click with radio. And we know it will, it just takes time.

9. Do you foresee a time when radio also welcomes multiple singles from one artist, or do you feel radio will remain the vehicle for creating critical, widespread, mass appeal on a targeted project?

I never want to say never. We tried the two singles thing with Dan + Shay a few years ago. We had one from their record go to #1, but we also tried to work a single from a soundtrack at the same time. There is so much music out there and only so much room on a playlist, so asking radio to commit to two like that is a pretty tall order. I'm not saying it's impossible - there are some definite superstars in our format that if they were going to try to do it, they would definitely have a better chance - but it would not be easy to do. Even though radio is still the #1 form of music discovery, people don't listen to the radio to hear new music; people listen to the radio to hear their favorite song. And therein lies the challenge with trying to work more than one song like that. Radio is trying to commit to what they think will be someone's favorite song.

10. Country radio always tells us there are too many singles thrown at them, in a time when they're running tighter lists. From the label side, what's your response to that?

I don't see that changing. Streaming has become an important source of revenue for every record label, so every time we put music out, it's a potential revenue stream for us. What we need to get away from is the attitude in this format that everybody needs to be a good partner and add a record, then play it twice a week in the Overnights, because that's not doing anybody any good. It's okay to say no. I would rather have 15 adds of real rotations where it's going in to a Full Light, where the spins are actually seeing the light of day, than 30 or 35 with 3/4 of the spins in the Overnight category with less than seven spins a week. Again, it's important to point out that it's not a criticism. Our wonderful partners in radio just want to help out, but we've gotten to a point where we're not helping each other anymore. I think they need to start making some tougher choices by committing to what's right and playing in rotation right away. Chris Janson's "Drunk Girl" is a great example; there was a time when I was preaching to the field staff when we were in the 40s with that record. At the time, the average spin growth between #30 and #50 on the chart was +28; there was nothing moving in that area. If you've got a whole bunch of stations playing a whole bunch of songs, and none of them are getting played much, guess what happens? You get an average growth of +28 in that region. Nothing's really moving if you get to the chart and look at #20 and up.

Okay, let's talk about some of the artists and projects you're excited about. It's late in 2018 now, but looking ahead, what are priorities for you?

Obviously, Cole Swindell is about to have another Top 5 record [with "Break Up In The End"], and hopefully another #1 record. Aside from him and Chris Janson edging the Top 5, on the new artist side, as a building, we're really excited about Cody Johnson. It's so nice to work with an artist like Cody - as we talked about earlier with having a road map and using tools available to us - here's a guy who sold out the Houston Rodeo as an independent artist, selling 75,000 tickets. It's so powerful and exciting to have a guy like that on the roster, and radio seems to be embracing him very early. I think he's gonna be a force to be reckoned with at Country radio. Dan + Shay is arguably the hottest artist in the format right now - one of two or three - and having been the leader of the WAR team for several years, originally as a regional, it's nice to finally see things coming together for these guys. We always thought the music was there and that they were there as artists, and now it's starting to solidify with them in the format. It's great to be working with Blake Shelton and Kenny Chesney here at Warner, too.