10 Questions with ... Perry Michael Simon

BRIEF CAREER SYNOPSIS:

• WHRC Haverford, PA
• Press Broadcasting (WJLK-A-F Asbury Park, WMOD-TV and WKCF-TV Orlando, WSJT-TV Philadelphia, WKXW Trenton, WTKS Orlando)
• WKXW (New Jersey 101.5) and WBUD Trenton
• Jarad Broadcasting Co. (WDRE Long Island, WWCP Albany, WIBF (WDRE) Philadelphia)
• KLSX Los Angeles
• Survivors of the Shoah Visual History Foundation
• Sabo Media
• KLYY-KVYY-KSYY (Y107) Los Angeles
• Comedy World Radio Network
• All Access Music Group

1. What kind of year has it been for talk radio?

I'd say it was both discouraging and hopeful. It's discouraging in that the number of jobs, and shows, seemed to shrink even further; there are very few opportunities for new voices to be heard, and what's left has been, largely, the same old stuff. On the other hand, after all these years, there was finally some movement towards putting more talk on FM, which is promising even if many of the initial converts are all-syndication, and the surge in putting Sports formats on FM is very positive. The initial returns on the Sports stations are strong enough, especially in the male demos, that there will be more, perhaps one or two in every market.

2. What do you tell people who want to break into talk radio?

It's tricky to address this, because it's way too easy to be really negative. It's true: there are not a lot of openings. The "farm system" isn't what it was. And any station that IS looking for talent is probably looking for someone who sounds a lot like the other people on the station, which means, basically, a middle-aged conservative guy in a suit and tie railing about the same national topics everyone else is talking about. That being said, there are opportunities, too. There ARE stations in smaller markets doing local talk, even if there might not be a lot of them. It requires persistence and patience and, definitely, a plan B that will pay the rent while you look. The other element is that, unlike the old days when you had to fight to get on the air just to practice and get a decent tape together, you can now do that aircheck yourself, and "practice" with a podcast. It's never been easier to get your show to people. Making money on it, on the other hand... not so easy.

3. Well, then, what about podcasts? Can you do it yourself and make a career out of it?

No. And by that, I mean yes. And not yet. And it depends.

The only people who are making any appreciable money with podcasts are doing it by having a specialized product for an audience which can be monetized through either subscription or highly targeted advertising. The number of podcasts in these categories is miniscule. So, no.

Yet, some people are making it work. Leo LaPorte is one. His podcasts fit the description of very-high-quality specialized product (tech talk of various stripes) for a highly motivated, loyal audience built through years on radio and TV, sold to specialized advertisers like Audible and Drobo and Ford Sync. Leo has a nearly perfect setup for the new era. And it's been difficult for him, too, but it's encouraging that he's not only still doing it but growing. It does, however, help that he has a day job -- a weekend job, technically -- on the radio.

But I think he's on the right path. There WILL, ultimately, be a business for podcasts, just as there will be a business for streaming, and for any other flavor of audio broadcasting. I don't think it's ready for a true mass audience, and the revenue opportunities aren't mature yet. That's part of the fact that we're sort of in an in-between period for the media....

4. What do you mean by "in-between period"? What will the next few years be like for the traditional media?

We're moving from the old model -- scarcity, advertiser-supported -- to a new model where there's no scarcity, anyone can do a "show," and advertisers are looking for something other than the traditional CPM model. Basically, traditional advertisers are pulling back on the "old" model, in which they buy a load of ads hitting a broad demographic and rely on frequency to beat the message into consumers' heads for when they're ready to buy. They're now looking to save money by paying only for results -- pay per click, pay per response, pay a per-sale fee. By that measure, traditional radio's toast.

But to go to a per-response model is to ignore how most products are really sold. Marketing only to those ready to buy right now is good if you're selling a Snuggie, but for a car or a food product or toys or most other things, the old model of spraying your message across the market and hammering it home so that when they're ready, they remember you, well, that DOES work. At some point, the twain shall meet, and marketers will want to use both per-click/per-response/per-inquiry and repetitive message advertising, and that will help revive the advertising market. It'll probably be too late for newspapers, and radio may never get some of its losses back, but there'll be a business there. It'll take some time to get to that point again, but there'll be growth.

All of that, however, will require clearing out the debt and the deadwood. There will be bankruptcies, the first big one coming, oh, any week now. Do't expect radical changes from this round; the lenders don't want to run these things, and want, mostly, present management to keep running it. It'll only be if the business doesn't start to turn around the losses, if the business doesn't grow, that they'll ask the right questions and act accordingly. In the meantime, there'll be more cuts, some spin-off sales if they can find anyone with the cash to buy stations, and a lot of treading water. But, unlike some of the other constant critics of radio management, I'm not ready to declare the medium dead.

5. Is the Fairness Doctrine coming back, either explicitly or through a back door like "localism"?

I think that everyone in Washington has priorities that are more pressing than the Fairness Doctrine. If the economy and health care and environment and Afghanistan weren't occupying everyone's time, I think that you'd see more movement on that, and I have no doubt Michael Copps will be pushing things towards some form of content examination (not an explicit Fairness Doctrine, but some "holding to account" based on subtle ideological standards, possibly as part of a strict renewal standard) at the FCC, but there's not a lot of public clamor for it, and, ultimately, the big money in Washington isn't agitating for anything. Besides, the FCC is focused on the Internet first, wireless second. I'd expect the primary content-regulation action to come in the ownership rules review as the FCC majority tries to find a way to turn back the clock on consolidation, but I'd be surprised if there's too much movement towards "balance" in 2010, unless, that is, the Democratic majority thinks they'll be ousted in November and wants to get as much done as possible before then, at which point Congress could pressure Genachowski to move while they can still shoot down any attempts to counteract it.

I could, however, be wrong.

6. WHat distresses you the most about radio right now?

I don't think that the talent development process is working. I think it's broken. I don't think the business values people who a) know what works, b) know good radio when they hear it, and c) can help talent improve. If there's any thought that comes to mind when I'm listening to talk radio right now, more often than I'd like, it's the thought that nobody is working with the talent. Bad topics, poor execution, reliance on verbal crutches, no chemistry, no commection with the audience... how does this stuff get on the air if the PD is listening and knows what he or she is doing? There are great PDs out there, but there are a lot of stations that sound rudderless. And the people who own and run these stations don't care right now, because it's all about making enough money to pay the debt service. Everything else is secondary. I hope that this changes before people give up on listening for good.

7. What happened to the 10 Questions archive? The Talent Toolkit? What's going on?

Patience. The guys who did an amazing job redesigning the site have a lot to do to continue to transition and rebuild the thing. The archives are being converted to the new format, the Toolkit awaits a reformatting, and there'll be a new back end to the stuff I do to replace the temporary solution with which I presently work (and suffer). It's all coming, and more.

8. Since the last time you interviewed yourself, what, and who, makes you laugh?

Lately? Not much. But I'll plug my friends Greg Behrendt, Dave Anthony, and Chris Hardwick, standups you should go see when they're in your town. And I still listen to my old afternoon shows John and Ken at KFI, the Regular Guys at Rock 100.5 Atlanta, and Deminski and Doyle at WCSX Detroit, because I can. And I do laugh at "30 Rock," "Parks and Recreation," "Modern Family," "Curb Your Enthusiasm," "South Park," anything Ricky Gervais and Stephen Merchant write, Phil Hendrie... see, now I'm gonna get in trouble for forgetting people. There are more, but I'm tired and that's all I can come up with at the moment.

9. What should talk programmers be doing with the PPM numbers?

Calm down. Remember that when you slice these numbers into days and hours and minutes and smaller demos, the sample is pretty much laughable. And you can see the panel changes affect your numbers when you fall off a cliff despite making no changes in programming. Don't panic. Just keep doing what you know to be good radio. Only if something is consistent and obvious -- for example, for a full year, your numbers plummet as soon as one show ends and another starts -- before assuming anything. Remember, too, that the meters DON'T measure some critical things, like WHY someone turned your station off: if the meter wearer turned the radio off to go to the bathroom, or because she reached her destination, or because she had to take a phone call, you can't use that drop to say that a topic or host didn't work. There's a lot we don't know about the numbers, and a lot that has yet to be refined.

10. Anything else?

Yeah, have a great holiday, whatever you may celebrate. Let's hope 2010 is an improvement. See you in January.