Norm Pattiz

It seems like déjà vu all over again for Norm Pattiz. After launching Westwood One, which made syndicated programming a household word, Pattiz started PodcastOne, which has fueled the growth of podcasting into a formidable entertainment and business platform. Now he's taking it one step beyond - into virtual reality, where cameras in the studio bring viewers up close and personal to the podcasters while they do the show. Here, Pattiz delves into that and how PodcastOne stays ahead of the curve on a burgeoning media platform.

When did you buy into the concept of virtual reality for podcasting?

We sat down with the folks at MandtVR; we already knew the principals and we discussed an idea for putting virtual-reality cameras in our studios. Their original idea was to do segments -- little pieces -- of each podcast. They'd create a lot of content that would attract fans of the various programs. When we saw what they could do, we immediately thought, "Why not make the entire podcast in VR, or 360 without the glasses?" -- because the strength of podcasting is in the connection with the audience, especially the P1 listeners who comprise the fan base. These are the people who want to find the program, and either listen through an active stream or download it to listen later.

360/VR content would mean those fans would be able to virtually sit in the studio with the hosts and guests, and be a part of the program without actually having to be in attendance. We immediately thought this would be very cool. We weren't aware of anybody else doing it; we're still not aware of any. That might be because others think we're crazy for trying it, but we have a history of looking for cutting-edge projects that goes back to the Westwood One days, and now here at PodcastOne over the last four years. It's actually accessible right now on the new PodcastOne app.

What was the greater challenge - getting the technology right or convincing the personalities to get involved?

The technology is right. We're already doing it on more than 10 podcasts, including Adam Carolla. Once Carolla decides to participate, it's not difficult to get others to follow.

It's no longer just a concept. It's happening right now, and it's available at PodcastOne.com. We see many other applications as well that will benefit our partners. For our comedians who do stand-up, and our hosts who do podcasts in front of an audience, we can take a 500-seater and make it as large as we want when we make it available to our consumers in VR.

Does having a camera in the studio impact how the host does his or her podcast?

Not really, except when video is involved, hair, makeup and wardrobe become far more important. And, of course, scheduling can be affected, as well as locations for interviews.

How much longer do you expect this to be in the beta process before you officially roll it out?

It's out there right now. We'll continuously be improving it, but it's consumable and marketable as we speak, with some great features that have not been seen in this industry yet.

Have you gauged the early reception from potential advertisers on VR/360? One would think they'd be enticed by a video element for their product or brand.

We've talked about it. Now, we actually have it. There have been many interested parties. Now, we have to turn interest into action because it's not just a concept anymore. We will not only be marketing it to advertisers, but also utilizing VR in our Premium offerings, as well as pay-per-view. Recently, Adam performed live on a cruise ship in a small venue. How many of his listeners would like to have been there and actually experienced it live? That's a question that we can now answer by putting them front row, center.

Are you still continually tweaking the technology?

Of course. Not only the technology, but the sets, the locations, and the interactivity. Content is always king. We're looking at VR providing an experience in everyday entertainment, not just diving out of an airplane, skiing down a virgin slope, or swimming next to a coral reef. We're focused on putting people in places where they would like to be, but for one reason or another, can't be. We want to maximize the feeling of actually being there.

Speaking of the new app you just officially launched, what benefits did you expect it to provide?

The app just launched this weekend. Go see it, use it, play with it. It still provides great search and categorization of programming. It will continue to evolve as all digital technology does, but we think in many aspects of digital-audio consumption, we're leading the way.

Along with the immersive 360-video and virtual reality experiences, the app now provides a very interactive environment with social capabilities, news feeds, real-time polls, behind-the-scenes photos and more. Listeners can simply listen to their favorite shows if that's what they want, or they can really engage with the content and personalities, a great way to penetrate the millennial audience even more.

Let's look at podcasting in general: There seems to have been exponential growth in the number of podcasts to choose from. How long will that last? Are you worried about surpassing a saturation level where the chances of a new podcast being discovered are akin to finding a needle in a haystack?

No, not at all. On-demand audio is here, it's real, and it's growing exponentially. It has endless opportunities for advertisers and marketers, plus the ability to connect directly with audiences who wish to pay a fee. Don't get me wrong, we're still a small business, but we're going to get much, much larger, pretty darn quick.

So PodcastOne will continue to add more programming? You're not concerned about giving each one enough time and energy to reach its potential?

What we do is try to keep our podcast list fluid. We're adding a bunch podcasts strictly for local consumption, such as what we're doing with Hubbard Broadcasting, where we take local radio programs and dayparts and make them available on demand, then measure their audience uplift for the radio stations.

On a national level, we have around 200 shows and we plan to keep it at that level. Although we don't always officially announce every new podcast on the network, we basically put new shows on it each month, and drop probably some of the podcasts down at the bottom of list, that have been given a good run but haven't lived up to expectations. There's a constant churn of the bottom 20%, but that's pretty good when you look at other mediums, and how few new shows have success.

In the beginning, our advertiser support came almost exclusively from direct response advertisers. Today, we're getting much more traction with major brands. There's hundreds of thousands of podcasts available in the marketplace now, but the shows that deliver huge individual audiences still can be counted in the hundreds. There's no such thing as over-saturation as it relates to consumers. In terms of what's being provided and pitched to advertisers, there is some risk.

The bottom line: it's amazing how the growth of PodcastOne mirrors the growth Westwood One 35 years ago, when we introduced syndicated programming. First, you evangelize. Then, you go out and build demand. The marketplace for podcasting is growing exponentially, and our plan is to grow right along with it. We're poised to take advantage of podcasting's growth on, not just our own platform, but the business in general.

What constitutes "a good run" when it comes to evaluating your future relationship with a podcast?

What constitutes a good run? A big audience, and solid revenue for as long as it lasts. That's a good run. The beauty of podcasting is how quickly you can take an idea, turn it into a podcast, look at the metrics, and determine what its future will be. This is not like greenlighting a movie. That can take years, with no guarantee that it will even be successful. PodcastOne is a 360-degree solution for good ideas, and a great sales, marketing and promotional platform for existing podcasts.

What about PodcastOne's future - do you have a five-year plan, or is the business so "in the moment" that you basically have to focus on the here-and-now?

Our focus involves our writers, producers, engineers, talent bookers, social media specialists, studios and technology solutions, along with our sales force and access to the best digital infrastructure. That's what makes us unique. That's why we don't call ourselves "PodcastTwo." We have both a short and long-term focus, and they're both important. Since I'm 70, I tend to think more about the here and now, and leave it to our futurists to chart our course. Well, maybe not entirely to the futurists. Things look pretty bright from here, and it's not like we haven't been down this road before.