Steve Hodges

Steve Hodges is not the type of guy to settle for being #2. When told to take his foot off the gas pedal when the sign-on station he was programming was close to usurping the #1 spot against the heritage Country rival in town, Hodges left to try his hand on the label side. At Capitol Nashville, Hodges and his team have taken a variety of acts, such as Keith Urban, Lady Antebellum and the ultimate in crossover success stories, former Hootie & The Blowfish singer Darius Rucker, to #1. In this interview, he explains how he and his artists have earned their success.

What made you decide to leave radio for the labels?

I didn't really think I wanted to leave radio. At that point in time, when I told the station GM that I had a job offer from a label, I still wanted to stay in a competitive situation with the station. It went from a sign-on 0 in the book to a 10 share against a heritage Country station -- and I wanted to see the job through. He quickly informed me that the local owners were very happy being #2, so I informed him that I was going to change careers.

After earning so much success, it must've taken you aback when your boss essentially said, "This is good enough."

I was totally in shock. We were all in a state of euphoria to have grown into the second-rated station in the market, going up against a longtime heritage Country radio station. To be in a position where we could actually win such a battle made us all very excited. To say the least, with the station on such a roll, this was an interesting conversation to have. At least he was honest with me. I don't regret leaving; I went from working with the labels on station promotions to spending time setting up promotions for radio.

Was the Capitol offer your first opportunity to try a different job?

No. In 1994, 16 years ago, we first got a 10 share and we started to do very well in the ratings. I had a couple of other offers, one from a major consultant and one from another radio station that I wasn't really excited about. But when this offer from Capitol/EMI came up, it was just too good to pass up. At that point in time Jimmy Bowen was the President; they were about to put out their third Garth record; they were really rocking. It would've been foolish of me not to take the job.

How was the transition? Were you surprised at how the business ran when you were now working from a label perspective?

Yes ... and I still think today there are major misconceptions out there. Although radio and records work side by side, many people on both sides don't understand what the other side does at all. I'm astonished with some of the conversations I've had with programmers. We take for granted that radio should know everything going on at labels, but they don't ... and vice versa. Too many label promotion staffers don't really have a grasp on what goes on at radio on a daily basis. We work hard here to try to get to know their world, their pressures, their needs and their expectations. Listening to their radio station is a simple way to start that process.

As a former programmer, has it been easier for you to be on the same page as the stations you work?

It's easy for me to talk to them because I can talk their language. I know what they look for in research, their scheduling problems and dealing with air talent ... all that good stuff. The hard part of the transition is learning how to make a case for your records from a sales perspective. Your first duty is to represent your artists and their music. Then you put your best step forward because you're competing against 30 other labels for that add.

Is breaking records easier now than when it was when you started? Is it any different and how?

Definitely harder, but it's never been easy. The old cliché of "the cream always rises to the top" still seems to be the case, but there are a few instances where put your head down to try and bust through ... and it might never pop. It does take longer now with the charts being so slow. We used to get a new artist with a brand new single on the radio and move the song up the chart in 12-16 weeks. Now we're lucky to be working one single from a new artist in a calendar year -- up to 40 weeks in some instances. It's definitely harder now to break a new act.

How does that slowdown impact your promotion plans for the entire album?

It's tough when you sit down with a business plan that hinges on the success of the first single or two to get the exposure needed to reach critical mass, so you can even afford to put an entire album out. If it was easy, everyone would do it. It's still about the airplay and exposure to reach the critical mass, so you can provide the consumer with something they hopefully want to buy.

How long can you stick with an artist before he/she/they finally push through? Emily West, for instance, is very talented, has charisma, and from the outside looking in, it looks like she should be a star. Does it get frustrating sometimes?

There is definitely no pre-determined deadline. The day when you look up and your forehead is bloody and you've got a pounding headache, you realize you're not going to bang through that wall, but you don't go down without a fight. There have been several instances where we release a song that struggles in the 40s, 30s, but finally kicks into gear once you get it to the 20s and it takes off.

A lot of it has to do with the time of year and the competition on the release schedule, but you can't worry about all that. You just put the best music out there because you believe in the artists and their music ... and you owe it to them to do the best job you can.

How has the PPM influenced how you promote your records? Has it made programmers even more cautious about playing a new artist record ... and what do you do to overcome that?

The majority of programmers who have lived in the PPM world for a year or more understand that you can't program by the day. You have to see what trends develop. If you watch Mscore and see a sudden decrease in a record, you really don't know what it's about. You don't know if listeners just turned off the car radio to go to work, or walked in to get a haircut or go to a meeting. Because there are so few meters in a market, it's tough to draw legitimate conclusions without waiting for that trend to develop.

I've had many conversations with programmers about the PPM; I always tell them that they were hired to program the radio station; they have two good ears to listen for hits and artists that will impact the audience - to make them tune in longer. The PPM conversion from paper diaries has been slow, but we all knew it would show cume to be lot larger than what was listed in the diaries, but it also shows people don't listen as long as they did ... they punch around a lot more.

There's been this conundrum for years about making sure Country stars don't become too popular or Mainstream, or else they'd lose their Country base. You now have Lady A at the precipice of that kind of mass-appeal success. What do you do to ensure they keep their Country base?

Lady Antebellum's Country fan base is priority #1 ... and everything that happens after that is gravy. Greg Thompson and his team in New York do a really great job for Lady A in formats outside of Country, but everyone from [Capitol Nashville Pres.] Mike Dungan to management on down knows that their #1 focus is on the Country format. If we happen to cross-pollinate, that's beneficial by reaching P2s and 3s who then might sample Country stations more often, which would be a win-win for everyone.

You also brought a pop artist into Country in Darius Rucker -- and not just a pop artist, but an African-American one. Nashville has been notorious for not treating pop artists too well when they try Country. What did you do to help Darius break through?

I've answered hundreds of questions about this and every time I have to attribute the success of Darius Rucker ... to Darius Rucker. He is a consummate pro who knows more about Country music than most would imagine. He's down to earth, honest and real, passionate and works very hard. He was once part of one of the biggest bands in the world that sold 30+ million records; now he comes out as an opening act on the Country circuit. He could probably headline by now, but he hasn't stepped out to do that yet. He's very grounded, respectful and appreciative at how he has been embraced by the Country world.

Was there a certain point in time when you knew he would break in Country?

Honestly, it was the very first week of his radio tour. I was with him when he did an event in San Antonio during the NCAA basketball championships in April. From there he went through the Southeast - Atlanta, Charlotte, Greenville and the Carolinas. By the end of that first week, it was very apparent that he was going to be embraced by most in our format, basically because of the music he had made and because of the type of person he was with that distinctive voice. He was very eager to hear stories about Country radio and learn about what goes on in that world. Of course, you never know what the future hold after the first week, but Darius turned a lot of heads

On top of Lady A and Darius, you have almost a half-dozen records on the charts. That seems like an awful lot of plates to keep spinning at one time. Is it hard to give each project the attention it deserves?

Having a lot of quality records to work is a good problem to have. Mike Dungan has done a phenomenal job of signing acts; in fact that there are no two on our rosters that are the same. All of the artists are unique in their own artistic way. Most are writers, which helps make their sound distinctive and consistent. Shane Allen, the promotion VP at Capitol, and Angela Lange, VP at EMI, do a great job of keeping everyone's eye on the ball. It's more pleasure than pressure. They're all great artists ... and working all these records is a good problem to have.

But how do you deal with the time management issue?

I deal with it by getting up at 5:30a and watching real-time before I go to bed at night. Everybody says they have their priorities; well in truth, everything is a priority. For records on the back of the charts, you work to get adds. For mid-chart records, you need to get a critical mass number of spins to get quality research at radio. Once you're inside the top 10, you hope that research continues to swell and the exposure starts impacting the consumer, who's deciding on whether or not to buy the record.

How has the performance royalty issues impacted your relationships with radio?

Unfortunately this is not something I have spent a lot of time investigating. This is one aspect of our business that I trust people higher up in our company to handle.

You just started a new imprint EMI Records. Why was that decision made now? And how will that label differ from what's on Capitol?

EMI is Mike Dungan's brainchild. It has been in the back of his mind for a couple of years. We, as a record company, always want to continue to grow and have the ability to sign artists that we really believe in. The workload on the promotion staff at Capitol is intensive, so to be able to sign new artists, give them their due attention in terms of time and focus and a totally dedicated staff is great. As far as being different than Capitol, the only difference is the actual artists. Outside of that there is the same 100% belief in those artists by both labels and their staffs.

How do you see your own future - personally ... and with Capitol?

Sixteen years ago, I was extremely happy just being a Regional. That might be the best job in promotion; you're solely responsible for one region, where you put your thumbprint on it and really get to know all those people inside and out. Then once get past that, you can't take too much for granted. You can't get too high or too down. The staff here at Capitol/EMI has a pretty grounded sense of the future. Everything we sign we think has a legitimate shot be successful at radio and retail, so you keep your head down and focus on the now and only look ahead to the immediate future. You can't afford to get ahead of yourself. We realize that we're lucky to be in this position.